Curse

Enchanted Warrior · Oct 03, 2006, 06:43 PM // 18:43

Just because someone does not know how to use a skill does not mean it should be removed. Too much emphasis is placed on winning and not enough on having fun and learning.

NinjaKai · Oct 03, 2006, 06:52 PM // 18:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enchanted Warrior

Just because someone does not know how to use a skill does not mean it should be removed. Too much emphasis is placed on winning and not enough on having fun and learning.

Exactly. Not everything is about dealing damage to win. Look at mesmers for a good example. They focus on controlling the enemy letting other team members pick them off. Elementalists are a great for more than jsut damage. I love using my ele as a support character.

Horseman Of War · Oct 03, 2006, 06:56 PM // 18:56

firestorm doesnt need to be removed.
noobs do.

I vote they remove it from Orion, but not the game- its a staple skill. And ya whoever was talking about W/E firestormers- agreed. Mucho LOL. breath of fire aint bad in many cases... Id never use it tho. Seems like it works ok in AB...

The best firestorm is cast at spirits.

And fire magic sucks in the deep lol.

Enchanted Warrior · Oct 03, 2006, 07:04 PM // 19:04

Firestorm is for crowd control. It disperses swarms.

IllusiveMind · Oct 03, 2006, 07:14 PM // 19:14

Quote:

And fire magic sucks in the deep lol.

I know that most enemies down there are weak to lighting...but Fire Magic is used for crowd control. If you can change most lighting spells to AOE, please lemme know

Winterclaw · Oct 03, 2006, 08:53 PM // 20:53

As everyone has said: DoT AoE = squishy defense. In fact if your PvE team has VOIP and is coordinated, you can make use of the fact that the mobs will be fleeing and use leaping mantis strike, ice trident, etc.

Aki Soyokaze · Oct 03, 2006, 10:43 PM // 22:43

Firestorm and other skills that have the same effect have their uses and if used properly can be very effective. And just because some people can't seem to use those skill properly isn't reason enough to remove them from the game. You're essentially asking them to dumb down the game for no reason. So if you're going to ask them to remove this skill, why not ask them to just roll the game back to when aggros didn't break. Better yet let them choose for us what skills we should take.

It's not the skill, it's the person who is using it.

/notsigned

dreamhunk · Oct 04, 2006, 01:53 AM // 01:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Faer

You're the one calling the Elementalist a healbot. That doesn't exactly give the impression that you have a clue, bucko.

Who are you to say how the profession is meant to be played? In all actuality, I'm curious as to your definition of an Elementalist. By all means, explain how they are meant to be played. It should be interesting.

Elementalists aren't useless in any respect. However, feel free to try and prove me wrong.

Oh, by the way... I have played an Elementalist. It was the first profession I ever played, and I put a good few hundred hours into it. I know what I'm talking about.

well very funny I still play elementalist!

so when did you put your elementalist down after the aoe update!!

If you stilled played your elementalist you would know what i am talking about! There is a ton of players that would agree with me. If you want to find fact use the sarch button I am sure there is 100000 flames + plus debate on the topic!

gr3g · Oct 04, 2006, 08:40 AM // 08:40

Fascinating how many people are pretending that Firestorm still has a use. It is no wonder at all that PvE is in such poor shape these days. If you need to spend 15 energy and 3 seconds to get a vanishingly tiny 10 second respite from pressure, then (a) your aggro control SUCKS, and (b) you have idiots playing your monks. Not surprising, because your monk earned his bonafides monking for Pet/Barrage or some similar broken build. There is never a good reason to use Firestorm. Nuking spirits indeed!

freekedoutfish · Oct 04, 2006, 09:06 AM // 09:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by dreamhunk

well very funny I still play elementalist!

so when did you put your elementalist down after the aoe update!!

If you stilled played your elementalist you would know what i am talking about! There is a ton of players that would agree with me. If you want to find fact use the serch button I am sure there flames + plus debate on the topic!

If im understanding this arguement right.

Dreamhunk, your saying that Elementals are absolutely useless within GWs?

So your stating that their incapable of doing anything useless within a battle, and as a profession cant achieve anything.

Whether this will prove you wrong, I dont know, but I hope it does...

....Dont be thinking im wanting to show off. Im not!

Im just trying to prove a point.

I'm willing to admit that the protector titles can be achieved by anyone, provided they have a good team, so that doesnt really proves anything.

But you cant honestly sit there and tell me that seeing as I have grandmaster on both continents, that the Elemental profession is useless.

You stated that elementals are only good at healing?

It takes more then "healing" to explore a continent. During my exploration I rarely carried healing skills. I left the healing to the hench monks.

And since an elemental cant run away from agro, I had to fight most of the time. I achieved those titles through very powerfull NUKING and slaughtering of groups.

You can scoff all you want. Ive no doubt you will.

You'l probably say I havent proved anything at all. Thats your choice.

But I would personally say that picture was very powerfull evidence that elementals are not useless.

Plus you can add the fact that when ever ive played with henches or humans, im nearly always the last one alive.

That isnt due to running away. I just seem to always survive.

If you want to get all macho about it. I also through in the fact I have two 15k armor sets for my ele, both died black. Thats assuming you judge greatness by material things.

You seem to be completely blind to the fact, that elementals do the most damage in the entire game. We can through out up to around 80+dmg in one strike. How could we be useless.

We provide one of the main support professions. I bet youve played many a mission or a quest that would have failed, did you not have an elemental covering your back.

I will also admit that there are alot of useless elementals in this game. But the same could be said for Warriors. Ive had many an incounter with a warrior who is just a trigger happy moron. Purely out to fight and agro everything. Ultimately killing the entire group.

But I also accept that good warriors exist because ive played along side them.

The point is that the greatness of a profession lies in who is playing that character. Yes some people are useless, and some arent.

gr3g · Oct 04, 2006, 09:14 AM // 09:14

The million dollar question is, freakedoutfish, is Firestorm in your skillbar?

Avarre · Oct 04, 2006, 09:23 AM // 09:23

Whether it's left in or not, whether people like it or not, the fact remains.

Firestorm sucks.

It's terrible damage. It's terrible AoE. It's a terrible defensive skill.

Just don't bring it, tell everyone you know not to bring it, and we'll quarantine that useless skill like smallpox!

Aki Soyokaze · Oct 04, 2006, 09:26 AM // 09:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by gr3g

The million dollar question is, freakedoutfish, is Firestorm in your skillbar?

Do you depend on one build and one build alone? If you do then I can understand why you'd actually ask this question. If not, then why do you bother to ask it. I'm perplexed as to why you'd even suggest that firestorm does or does not need to be in ones skill bar. If you're even half decent at coming up with your own builds you'll know that you use some skills more than other and you use them according to what the situation calls for.

gr3g · Oct 04, 2006, 09:30 AM // 09:30

Fine, consider the question amended to "is Firestorm ever in your skillbar?"

Though I suppose you can answer that with "yes, when I'm nuking suits of armor."

Enjoy your silly semantic game if that's what you make of it. I ain't playin'.

Aki Soyokaze · Oct 04, 2006, 09:51 AM // 09:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by gr3g

Fine, consider the question amended to "is Firestorm ever in your skillbar?"

Though I suppose you can answer that with "yes, when I'm nuking suits of armor."

Enjoy your silly semantic game if that's what you make of it. I ain't playin'.

Then what are you playing? Insult everyone under the sun?

Quote:

Fascinating how many people are pretending that Firestorm still has a use. It is no wonder at all that PvE is in such poor shape these days. If you need to spend.... then (a) your aggro control SUCKS, and (b) you have idiots playing your monks. Not surprising, because your monk earned his bonafides monking for Pet/Barrage or some similar broken build....

You know what maybe you're right. Maybe since so many people out there that think that firestorm still has use it's no wonder PvE is in such bad shape. And since there are so many people that think that then obviously our aggro control is bad and all the monks out there are idiots.

But since there are so many 'bad' players out there, as you seem to suggest, then I guess that firestorm does have an actual use. It can help all of us who can't control our aggro and it'll help the monks who apparently can't heal and need a 10 second rest.

I guess that means you're in favor of it staying?

The fact remains that it's a skill. There's nothing special about it and infact sometimes it can just downright suck. But I'm not going to throw it out the window just because at the moment I'm not using it. Nor will I browbash other people over the fact that they may or may not have a use for it. And yes people who do use it inapporpriately are going to get an earful, from me included.

But if you dont' like it as much as you seem to, then don't use it! If you don't like it being in the skill-bars of other players then make sure to inform them and let them know not to use it. Or just stick to guild groups or groups of friends that you know aren't going to use it. There is no reason for you to go on a rant about how everyone out there must be an idiot just because they don't use a skill as much as they used to.

Amity and Truth · Oct 04, 2006, 09:59 AM // 09:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

You seem to be completely blind to the fact, that elementals do the most damage in the entire game. We can through out up to around 80+dmg in one strike. How could we be useless.

Ugh. That's just so terribly wrong it almost made me kill a kitten. Fun aside, read my post above as to why that statement is dead wrong. I agree on the other thing though. Elementalist is a good support class with some minor backup damage. It's just that they suck badly at dealing damage.

In PVE:
AL > Elementalist

In PVP:
Kiting > Elementalist

Avarre · Oct 04, 2006, 10:06 AM // 10:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aki Soyokaze

But since there are so many 'bad' players out there, as you seem to suggest, then I guess that firestorm does have an actual use. It can help all of us who can't control our aggro and it'll help the monks who apparently can't heal and need a 10 second rest.

Except that firestorm isn't good. Learn to control you aggro, learn how to transfer aggro to the warrior if you've been targetted. If you seriously need a defensive aoe, things like symbol of wrath are faster and better controlled.

Aki Soyokaze · Oct 04, 2006, 10:24 AM // 10:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

Except that firestorm isn't good. Learn to control you aggro, learn how to transfer aggro to the warrior if you've been targetted. If you seriously need a defensive aoe, things like symbol of wrath are faster and better controlled.

I don't need a lesson on aggro control, transfer of the aggro, or the use of defensive aoe. Perhaps you missed this.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aki Soyokaze

The fact remains that it's a skill. There's nothing special about it and infact sometimes it can just downright suck. But I'm not going to throw it out the window just because at the moment I'm not using it. Nor will I browbash other people over the fact that they may or may not have a use for it. And yes people who do use it inapporpriately are going to get an earful, from me included.

gr3g · Oct 04, 2006, 10:36 AM // 10:36

Dear Aki, the point I (and possibly Avarre) is trying to make is that there is no appropriate use for this skill. The rebuttal to this statement cannot be "yes, people use it inappropriately". I (we) claim that all uses are inappropriate.

The proper rebuttal is to demonstrate an appropriate use for this skill. For example, you can attempt to rebut with the statement "I can use Firestorm to nuke spirits and minions because they don't moove or don't flee from AoE." It would still not be a valid rebuttal because (a) 15 energy, 3 second cast, 30 second recharge just to take out a few adjacent spirits is worse than ridiculous in both PvP and PvE, and (b) minion nuking is never needed in PvE (unless your MM dies, but that's another can of worms) and is no longer needed in PvP now that minion factory is dead.

Yes, it's a skill, as you say. No one has doubted the fact of its existence.

Avarre · Oct 04, 2006, 10:43 AM // 10:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by gr3g

Dear Aki, the point I (and possibly Avarre) is trying to make is that there is no appropriate use for this skill. The rebuttal to this statement cannot be "yes, people use it inappropriately". I (we) claim that all uses are inappropriate.

Bingo.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aki Soyokaze

I don't need a lesson on aggro control, transfer of the aggro, or the use of defensive aoe. Perhaps you missed this.

Superb, you managed to confuse yourself. You were talking about how 'bad' players would need the skill, and my point is, they don't. So unless you're one of the 'bad' players you're talking about, how am I even talking to you? Unless of course you aren't confused at all, in which case that makes so much sense...

Point is, there is no viable use of firestorm that makes it worth a skill slot. Yes, you can scatter mobs with it. You can do the same by moving around the tank to transfer aggro. Why bring a skill when you can do just as good without it? Soon to be 1000+ skills, and 8 slots. Firestorm will never be worth one of those 8 slots in it's current state.